Fireworks Banning

Discussion in 'Firework News' started by Galactic Nigel, Jun 9, 2016.

  1. Galactic Nigel

    Galactic Nigel Pyro-King Staff Member

    Here is a copy of what John Bennett from the Fireworks Magazine will be publishing in the next magazine.

    Debate on restriction of fireworks
    A debate held on Monday 6 June discussed an online petition which called for further restriction of the use of fireworks by the general public to specific days - a demand which would prevent the public from using fireworks at weddings, funerals, parties and special events, such as HM The Queen's birthday.

    Contrary to news reports, often prompted those opposing firework use, there were no Government promises to restrict firework use further. On the contrary the official statement ruled this out. (See below)

    The Government's full response:

    'Current firework regulations allow fireworks for home use to be sold during the traditional firework periods of Bonfire Night (15 October – 10 November), New Year’s Eve (26 December – 31 December), Chinese New Year (the day of the Chinese New Year and three days immediately before), and Diwali (the day of Diwali and three days immediately before).

    'Suppliers who wish to sell fireworks outside the traditional periods must comply with stringent conditions before being granted a licence by their local licensing authority. This means the availability and use of fireworks outside the traditional periods has been greatly reduced.

    'The regulations also created a curfew preventing the use of fireworks between 11.00pm and 7.00am all year round with the exception of 5 November, when the curfew starts at 12 midnight, and New Year’s Eve, Chinese New Year and Diwali, when the curfew starts at 1.00 am on the night of celebration.

    'We understand concerns about the distress noisy fireworks can cause to pets, livestock and wildlife. This is one of the reasons that there is a noise level limit of 120 decibels on fireworks for home use. We realise, however, that even at this level fireworks noise can be distressing to some animals and refer owners to advice on keeping animals safe during fireworks periods. This is freely available from animal charities, such as the Blue Cross which gives both general and species-specific advice on its website.

    'In addition there is Government-sponsored advice and guidance on the safe and considerate use of fireworks on the Safer Fireworks website.

    'Excessive noise from fireworks, or noise during the curfew period, can be considered a statutory nuisance and local authority environmental health officers have the power to investigate complaints of fireworks noise and act to prevent it where appropriate.

    'Although there is some use of fireworks outside the traditional periods, we believe that the majority of people who use fireworks do so at the appropriate times of year and have a sensible and responsible attitude towards them. There are no plans at the moment to place further limitations on their use.'

    - Department for Business, Innovation and Skills

    The petition was worded as follows:

    'Fireworks now occur at all times of the day and evening for many weeks during the autumn and winter. Pet and animal owners struggle to keep their companion animals safe during this extended period. We call for fireworks use by the general public to be permitted on traditional celebration dates only.
  2. Anthony

    Anthony Galactic Firework Addict

    I think things will stay as they are because of the following;

    a) a retail sale/private use ban will only open the floodgates to dangerous powerful, potentially lethal, and possibly deadly firework imports from Europe and beyond ie India China etc sold on the black market which would kill burn maim or seriously injure the users setting them off, and/or spectators watching them if they malfunction or go wrong in use,

    b) also if retail sales/private use of fireworks are banned, then small medium and large display companies that also rely on additional income generated thru retail sales of consumer fireworks in a retail shop/unit to prop them up thru the year will fold putting more and more people in unemployment,

    c) and in the face of a ban on retail sales/private use of fireworks, idiots could be tempted to make their own fireworks and pyrotechnic devices from household chemicals and/or household substances causing a house fire or explosion while making them or they could injure or kill a loved one or relative while being set off and used if they go badly wrong or malfunction in use.

    Those three reasons are exactly what the Govt fear if retail sales/private use of fireworks are banned-fact.
    Last edited: Jun 9, 2016
  3. BrocadeKnight

    BrocadeKnight Galactic Firework Addict

    I watched it live on
    It was 2 hours of inaccurate nonsense concluded brilliantly by Boris Johnson's brother Jo saying no plans to limit firework use.
    To be fair, about 40% of those who spoke prefaced their words by saying how much they like fireworks and hope they'll still he around for future generations. One said repeatedly she really really likes them. I assume they were MPs who'd had strong representations from the anti lobby, who had to at least represent those views, given the ePetition exceeded 100,000 votes.
    Personally I think the most needed ePetition is to abolish ePetitions. 100,000 folks jumping on a bandwagon in these social media times is not a significantly large number. And look at the aftermath of the gorilla shooting and the Japanese kid left in the forest. I'm not even on social media but I've heard the sheeple of the word came out shouting.
    Galactic Nigel likes this.
  4. danielpyronutter

    danielpyronutter Galactic Fireworks Forum Member

    the figures of people hurt by dog attacks far exceed any firework related injuries and seeing as most of these epetioneners were worried about there dogs mental health lol I think they are crackpots. I'm sure many pyromaniacs have dogs and they are not worried and I'm sure there dogs will get over it.
  5. Jinn Kyja

    Jinn Kyja Super Moderator Competition Meet 2015 Champion

    I wasn't going to mention dogs, *cough* I'm aware of people that love both *cough*...
    But I reckon you can train a dog a hell of a lot more easily than you can train its owner.

    I've had a loose dog at a display, had it's nose at the base of a cake and was trying to pounce on each shot. I absolutely plopped myself.
    Pause firing - "It's ok, he loves it" the owner said...maybe, but what if he caught one?!?

    Finished the display, I'm more of a cat person myself.
    Last edited: Jun 11, 2016
  6. Galactic Nigel

    Galactic Nigel Pyro-King Staff Member

    You certainly are a pussy lover Jinn Kyja (jk) :)

    Also loved that Brocade Knight (bk) said lets get a 100,000 epetition to ban epetitions :) LOL brilliant
  7. thetechi

    thetechi Galactic Firework Addict

    I haven't been on for a very long time now, which I admit saddens me greatly.

    I'm still alive and hope to be back on regularly very soon.

    But a news story I read today made me so angry - I thought I would come and vent here.

    Here, fireworks are seen in a bad light because a 4 year old was burnt.

    But what the article doesn't say anywhere is that the girl in the video only appears to be about a meter away from the firework.
    Even if it was Cat 2 - there's no chance she was 8 meters away. This is why safety distances exist!!!!

    Rant over. I love you all.
    Anthony, Jinn Kyja and Krony like this.
  8. Krony

    Krony Galactic Firework Addict

    Yea read that on the other forum, poor safety distance and they blame the fireworks industry.
  9. martywolfman

    martywolfman Galactic Firework Enthusiast

    What annoys me about this too, whether they were being used properly or not, is that one accident causes people to call for them being banned.

    how many kids are injured, maimed and killed riding bikes, in car crashes, on playgrounds etc?

    yes, what happened to this little girl is terrible, but if the solution is removing all things that could potentially hurt someone, what kind of world would we live in?
  10. Jinn Kyja

    Jinn Kyja Super Moderator Competition Meet 2015 Champion

    Same, saw it on the other forum and somebody pointed out her trampoline has no safety net.
    End user to blame, unfortunately.

    Just wondering if Johnny One-Eye from my council estate would get the same coverage?

    EDIT: Miss you too, @thetechi - I don't do facebook but I have people stalking you just to give me hair updates.
    thetechi and Krony like this.
  11. Anthony

    Anthony Galactic Firework Addict

    I saw the report on BBC Breakfast when it was broadcast : I don't think that roman candle was set up properly either hence it falling over, it looked like it was not quite pushed into the ground adequately for total safety.

    You must always bury tall roman candles (which don't have a plastic ground spike on the bottom of it) at least half way up in soft ground or bucket of sand/earth and make sure it is firm and secure before lighting it...
    Last edited: Nov 19, 2017
  12. Heath Robinson Man

    Heath Robinson Man Galactic Fireworks Forum Member

    So this incident in which a 4 year old gets injured. l shall now point a BIG FINGER OF BLAME AT THE EU for their dangerous CE firework directives. Sue them b*astards.
    Why is this? Well lets take a look at a small typical selection box that those not too well informed may buy from supermarkets. Something like Sunfire from standard fireworks but many others are similar and contain the same dangers because of malicious hostile legislation.
    While the box will indicate a 8m or so minimum safety distance that is just a guide as to possible contents. We should look at the instructions on the fireworks themselves. To not do so, is dangerous. So we read on a number of fountains in such a box and note that a 1m minimum safety distance is stated on them. This foresee-ably (and that is key to the legal issue involved) can make people feel comfortable to be very close to lit fireworks. If its considered safe to be very near a number of items (cylinder type fountains) and another cylinder type firework is next then people may skip reading each and every firework instructions and assume 1m is far enough away to be safe when it is certainly not the case.
    Lets be realistic people will not read instructions on every firework just as much as most drivers will not fully read through all the manufacturers instructions supplied with a motor vehicle before operating it. People make assumptions. They may be right or wrong. They can be foreseen. Sticking 1m advised safety distance items in a box with other fireworks that advise significantly greater safety distances is accidents in the making and has in my view been demonstrated.
    If its not broken then don't fix it old wise saying. BS specs did not cause this issue and CE specs DID. Dump the dodgy EU rules and go back to how it used to be which appears much safer in my view.
    Oh and 1 m ...that may be safe when a firework performs correctly as designed. It can be woefully dangerously too close if the firework is faulty or damaged and as the CE morons do not deal with this in my view they are not fit to advise or make laws of any kind and anything they did create or are party to should be terminated and replaced back to prior arrangements prior CE regs.
    Anthony likes this.
  13. Anthony

    Anthony Galactic Firework Addict

    I agree with you all the way indeed. That 1m safety distance is indeed very risky : as it only takes a malfunction in a firework or a manufacturing defect to create a hazard and on some of the 1 metre fountains, particularly the crackling sparks from the small outdoor selection box fountains marked CE Cat 1 1m, I have personally found that these can get uncomfortably close to people watching them at 1 metre away.

    I always stand 8 metres from these even if they are marked 1 metre spectator safety distance, but many blissful people who don't know better wont, and they will always naturally follow the 1 metre distance stated on the labels and / or packaging and stand that distance away, and the reason that they are given 1 metre is because of the anomalies of NEC weight and contained explosive content i.e if they fall below a certain NEC and have a low explosive weight, then unfortunately they can indeed be marked 1 metre spectator safety distance, which ridiculously classes them as CE Cat F1 too, which you'd expect see more use of, on indoor sparklers / party poppers / indoor firework selections and ice-fountains, but not outdoor consumer fireworks.

    Under BS 7114 part 2 1988 specifications, all small fireworks under Category 2 are sensibly given a 5 metre spectator safety distance rating regardless of explosive content / weight that they contain, the current BS-EN15947 doesn't allow for that.

    The British Fireworks Association and British Pyrotechnists Association are indeed absolutely angry and are extremely FURIOUS about these European Standards BS-EN 15947 : 2010 because they also put powerful previous Cat 3 stuff at a dangerous 8 metres safety distance as well as new powerful 8 metre CE F2 fireworks at that distance, which doesn't properly take into account, fallout / debris distances away from the functioning firework case when it is going off as BS 7114 did.

    BS7114 part 2 1988 did indeed go way over the top on some small fireworks giving them a distance of 25 metres spectator distance, but at the same time, this was a good safety margin in case of a manufacturing defect or a malfunction in operation causing serious safety worries, and if a firer ignored that 25 metre spectator safety distance printed on the labels and packaging, and something went badly wrong with that firework and it hurt injured or burnt somebody, it would indeed be the firer at fault for not observing manufacturer's specified safety distance printed on the packaging and labels and NOT the fault of the manufacturer / distributor or importer.

    Now if accidents increase because of the anomalies of small selection box fireworks marked as CE Cat 1 fountains marked 1 metre being used at 1 metre spectator distance and powerful ex-Cat 3 fireworks redesigned and marked 8 metres (and indeed new powerful 8 metre fireworks) being used at 8 metres, then it could well get to a stage where Govt will either ban the general retail sale and private use of fireworks due to the horrific accident rates, OR and I think realistically and sensibly, the better alternative (if you want to avoid illegal black market sales of fireworks to the public and people trying to make their own fireworks in the face of such a ban) is that the British Fireworks Association and British Pyrotechnists Association will bring pressure to bear on the Govt to be allowed to make changes to to the BS-EN15947 : 2010 standard so things will happen like this and we will see (if approved) :

    CE Cat F1 indoor fireworks being marked with and have a spectator safety distance of 1 metre or in the case of indoor hand held devices such as party poppers and indoor sparklers / novelty matches etc., no safety distance as these are quite safe to hold anyway,

    CE Cat F2 outdoor selection box / pack fireworks and single items being marked with a spectator safety distance of 8 metres all the way even on very small NEC weight items,

    Larger and more powerful CE Cat 2 outdoor selection box fireworks, and single / multipack fireworks being marked with a 15 metres spectator safety distance with a firer safety distance of 8 metres (the firer firing these would also be advised to wear suitable personal protection whilst firing these in a safety leaflet or guide enclosed in selection boxes, display kits and multipacks and this would also be issued free at the point of purchase with those separate fireworks as well as a downloadable printable PDF version on the manufacturers / importers / distributors website),

    CE Cat 3 outdoor selection box / pack fireworks, as well as individual CE Cat 3 fireworks, will be marked with a spectator safety distance of 25 metres, and a firer safety distance of 15 metres (the firer firing these would be expected to wear suitable personal protection whilst firing these and this information would be printed in a safety leaflet or guide enclosed in selection boxes display kits and multipacks and would also be issued free at the point of purchase with those separate fireworks as well as a downloadable printable PDF version on the manufacturers / importers / distributors website).

    Although even with Brexit, a lot of firework industry insiders have said "that to bring back British Standard 7114 would be extremely costly because of all the costs and expense to UK firework manufacturers / importers and distributors of changing existing stock to meet the new requirements of BS-EN 15947 : 2010", but personally I think that, realistically, pressure will be brought to bear on the Govt from the BFA/BPA which will force a change to undo this unsafe potentially dangerous situation and readjust safety distances etc on current product lines and new ones.

    P.S. by the way, I have neatened up your post into sensible tangible form by way of paragraphs and punctuation which makes it easier to take in, read and understand and I have also added some bits of my own to add meat to your argument. I agree with you 100% ;)
    Last edited: Nov 22, 2017
    Heath Robinson Man likes this.

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